10 replies to this topic Post Order

[Grondpad]

I mostly do mountain biking but do like doing some triathlons and run the occasional road & trail race as well.

With mountain biking I do marathons and in triathlons I enjoy the cross triathlons and Xterra the most. 2 Weeks ago I bought a road bike (really nice deal on the hub) because I want to do a couple of Standard distance triathlon’s and half Ironman’s.

This past weekend I did the Cullinan mountain bike marathon and I did very very bad. I dropped 209 places from last year. This trend is coming from last year since I started actually training for triathlon’s by incorporating a lot of swimming and running into my training as well. I did worse at Sabie & the Magalies monster (placing in 2011 vs 2012).

The issue is that I am training really really hard and recovering well. I do about 8 or 9 sessions a week and get enough rest (1 full rest day and one recovery ride) so I do not understand why I cannot perform in MTB marathons. It just doesn’t make sense. I do not get tired in the ‘Lungs’ but rather in the ‘Legs’. Should I start doing weight training for my legs?

Do you think it is unrealistic to try and do well in mountain biking (and by well I mean top 15% of the field) and try and do some triathlons as well. Is my expectations to high or is it doable?

[Cyclewizz]

How many hours a week were you cycling before ?
How many hours a week are you currently cycling ?

[Grondpad]

Cyclewizz, on 16 July 2012 - 10:01 , said:

How many hours a week were you cycling before ?
How many hours a week are you currently cycling ?

Old:
2 X Intervals on the bike (one long and one short)
1 X Long ride
2 X Cross training (always running)

Hours cycling about 8 per week

New:
1 X Interval on bike
1 X recovery on bike
1 X long ride
2 X short run (one interval, one tempo)
1 X Long run
2 X Swim

Hour cycling about 6/7 per week

[Berg Bok]

MTB is one tough sport, it requires much more power and climbing ability than any other discipline. Do more climbing and power weight training in the gym. MTB requires strong legs, core muscles and also upper body strength. Your training is too much cardio focussed.

Edited by Berg Bok, 16 July 2012 - 10:24 .

[Li Mu Bai]

well you certainly have not added much riding time. Marathons need a huge LSD base for endurance as well as intervals for speed and power closer to target race day. diluting your time on the bike wont make you a better marathon rider.

[Li Mu Bai]

Berg Bok, on 16 July 2012 - 10:20 , said:

MTB is one tough sport, it requires much more power and climbing ability than any other discipline. Do more climbing and power weight training in the gym. MTB requires strong legs, core muscles and also upper body strength.

you should do LOTS of core work, mtb marathon does require a strong core.

[Grondpad]

Berg Bok, on 16 July 2012 - 10:20 , said:

MTB is one tough sport, it requires much more power and climbing ability than any other discipline. Do more climbing and power weight training in the gym. MTB requires strong legs, core muscles and also upper body strength. Your training is too much cardio focussed.

Thanks Berg Bok

How much do you recommend? Will one very hard session of squads, lunges, climbing stairs with weights and jumps be sufficient (combined with core exercises)?

Li Mu Bai, on 16 July 2012 - 10:23 , said:

well you certainly have not added much riding time. Marathons need a huge LSD base for endurance as well as intervals for speed and power closer to target race day. diluting your time on the bike wont make you a better marathon rider.

I agree 100% with you and I think I can stretch the long ride on the weekends and maybe add another interval.

It just I think there should be a balance between the amount of training done and the gain you see. I have dropped 15% in placing over the weekend but only do 1 hour less of training in a week on the bike. It just doesn’t make sense, or will 4 hours a month have such a huge impact?

[SwissVan]

Grondpad, on 16 July 2012 - 09:52 , said:

1. It just doesn’t make sense. I do not get tired in the ‘Lungs’ but rather in the ‘Legs’.

2. Should I start doing weight training for my legs?

3. Do you think it is unrealistic to try and do well in mountain biking (and by well I mean top 15% of the field) and try and do some triathlons as well. Is my expectations to high or is it doable?

1. Your doing a lot of cardio work (Running, swimming and cycling), so no suprise there.
2. Hmm no, not unless you have plenty of spare time. Rather focus on strengthing your legs cycling and doing Lactate threshold (LT) work outs on the bike.
3. Yes, provided you do the right bike training.

To achieve top 15% mtb results you need to improve your ability to ride longer at or just below your LT by incorporating LT efforts into your training. For example once a week after warming up do 2 or 3 x 15-20 min at LT effort with 15 min at 50-60% between each LT effort. In the beginning 15- 20 min might be to long and if you struggle to complete them then start off with 3 x 5 - 10 minutes.

[Grondpad]

SwissVan, on 16 July 2012 - 10:30 , said:

1. Your doing a lot of cardio work (Running, swimming and cycling), so no suprise there.
2. Hmm no, not unless you have plenty of spare time. Rather focus on strengthing your legs cycling and doing Lactate threshold (LT) work outs on the bike.
3. Yes, provided you do the right bike training.

To achieve top 15% mtb results you need to improve your ability to ride longer at or just below your LT by incorporating LT efforts into your training. For example once a week after warming up do 2 or 3 x 15-20 min at LT effort with 15 min at 50-60% between each LT effort. In the beginning 15- 20 min might be to long and if you struggle to complete them then start off with 3 x 5 - 10 minutes.

Thanks SwissVan

I am sure I can work this into my training. Do you recommend a road or MTB ride for this? As the road surface is more ‘even’, I presume it’s better to control the HR for the LT? Do you think I can replace an interval session with this workout?

[Berg Bok]

Weight training in the gym for legs, core and upper body is a very time efficient way of boosting your strength, but should not replace time in the saddle, you will still need long rides for endurance too. I would recommend changing your training when you need some strength for MTB. A few good strength training sessions from just 2 weeks before the event could make a big difference, then when you train for non-MTB stuff focus more on cardio before the event.

[SwissVan]

Grondpad, on 16 July 2012 - 10:39 , said:

Thanks SwissVan

I am sure I can work this into my training. Do you recommend a road or MTB ride for this? As the road surface is more ‘even’, I presume it’s better to control the HR for the LT? Do you think I can replace an interval session with this workout?

I’m not sure what kind of intervals you are doing so hard to comment on that.

For LT sessions you want to be able to ride for the full period (i.e. 15 - 20 minutes) without having to disrupt the effort so ideally you need a long flat quite road, not easy to find.
I know the IDT is not popular on da hub but using an IDT is perfect for these type of sessions.
Yes HR (or watts) is important for LT sessions, you need to ride at the target intensity for the entire effort which is easily monitored via HR or power measurement.

IMHO on the bike strength training is far more beneficial for cycling than any gym training, except for core training which in any case can be done at home without going to a gym.