21 replies to this topic Post Order

[davetapson]

Mid December I was probably as cycling fit as I've ever been. Family commitments, plus not being 100% well around then meant that my training stopped on the 15th.

So, on the 28th, feeling full of Christmas Pud etc, I figured "Well, I've had two weeks of solid taper, and a week of solid carbo loading - let's go and smash out a pb at Suikerbosrand..."

So...

I loaded up with low GI go-juice and headed out.

At Sedaven Dam I was about 10mins up on my normal time. Coming across the Western entrance road I was still about 10 mins up, but feeling not too full of energy. Coming over the ridges that lead down to the long stretch across the valley bottom before the big hill I was not coping so well. On the valley bottom I bonked so bad I nearly fell off my bike.

I dragged my sorry ass under a tree for half an hour or so to recover (as much as you can when you bonk) and then granny-geared to the bottom of the hill, walked up it (have NEVER walked on this hill) and shortcutted back down to the parking lot.

My suspicion is that low GI energy drinks cannot provide sufficient energy for long duration high intensity efforts.

Has anyone else found this?

(Yeah, yeah - I hear all the 'eat gels whadda whadda' but what I want to know is if other people find that low GI energy drinks are not sufficient to sustain long duration high intensity efforts on their own. Because 'old fashioned' high GI drinks can.)

PS: Note, I am a fan of the low GI idea, so not just trying to trash it for trashing sakes.

[Cyclewizz]

Really doubt it was the low GI drink.
I've done a 160km ride on 32Gi & I had energy all the way.

I think your problem was the Christmas pudding and if you were sick then your body took a beating.

That said, you probably went out to fast and then popped.
To make up 10min in 25km you must have been going balls to the wall and then POP !!!

I was off the bike for 2.5 weeks while on holiday, also ate like a pig & drank like a fish. When I got back on the bike she just didn't want to go like before, obviously the 2.5weeks rest the bike had was a very bad idea.

Mark (MDW) from 32Gi has written an article about diet leading up to a race/ride and how important it is and one can't only rely on the carb drink of the day.
I think it's under the 32Gi thread.

[Man with no name]

Dave, in my personal experience I have found that low GI works VERY well for long endurance rides. I dont even eat an energy bar for anything up to 4.5 hours, and still dont bonk, provided I ride below 150 bpm most of the time (LT = 171 bpm). A zone of 130-140 bpm is ideal.

However, over 150 bpm you need to look a higher GI type of drink (I prefer Cytomax), preferably with a lactic acid buffer, although not everybody believes in the latter. Lastly, having not ridden for two weeks, your glycogen stores may have been very low, in which case the low GI certainly wont help!

[davetapson]

_47_, on 04 January 2012 - 08:26 , said:

Dave, in my personal experience I have found that low GI works VERY well for long endurance rides. I dont even eat an energy bar for anything up to 4.5 hours, and still dont bonk, provided I ride below 150 bpm most of the time (LT = 171 bpm). A zone of 130-140 bpm is ideal.

However, over 150 bpm you need to look a higher GI type of drink (I prefer Cytomax), preferably with a lactic acid buffer, although not everybody believes in the latter. Lastly, having not ridden for two weeks, your glycogen stores may have been very low, in which case the low GI certainly wont help!

Agree with the first part - low GI cool for long training rides, for sure, but not high intensity effort. If you're aiming to do high intensity stuff, you got to use something with more available energy.

I disagree with low glycongen stores theory tho - if you haven't been exercising (and been eating!), your muscle / liver glycogen stores must be pretty topped up?

My experience with running was that when I was fit, my first run after a short layoff would be awesome, and I'm pretty sure it was because the glycogen levels were high.

[davetapson]

Indigo Kid, on 04 January 2012 - 08:25 , said:

That said, you probably went out to fast and then popped.
To make up 10min in 25km you must have been going balls to the wall and then POP !!!

This did cross my mind, hence this thread. But it felt more like a bonk than a pop...

[Man with no name]

davetapson, on 04 January 2012 - 08:48 , said:

Agree with the first part - low GI cool for long training rides, for sure, but not high intensity effort. If you're aiming to do high intensity stuff, you got to use something with more available energy.

I disagree with low glycongen stores theory tho - if you haven't been exercising (and been eating!), your muscle / liver glycogen stores must be pretty topped up?

My experience with running was that when I was fit, my first run after a short layoff would be awesome, and I'm pretty sure it was because the glycogen levels were high.

I hear you, but I do understand that if you take more than a week off your body starts shedding some of your glycogen reserves, but I will be the first to say I am no expert here. All I know is 32GI worked really well for me in December - I lost 4 kgs, am 2 kgs from race weight and manage to do 2400 kms since mid November - very happy with that result.

[Pronutro]

Indigo Kid, on 04 January 2012 - 08:25 , said:

That said, you probably went out to fast and then popped.

No doubt in my mind that this is exactly what happened

[Martin.H]

Are there any other low Gi drinks on the market? Paying R200 / kg for sugar is a bit steep.

[Man with no name]

El Ten, on 04 January 2012 - 08:02 , said:

Are there any other low Gi drinks on the market? Paying R200 / kg for sugar is a bit steep.

The only two I am aware of is Biogen's Carbogen and 32GI

[Lucky Luke.]

El Ten, on 04 January 2012 - 08:02 , said:

Are there any other low Gi drinks on the market? Paying R200 / kg for sugar is a bit steep.

I like my 32 GI, but then low cal squash also works pretty well for me if you're on a budget.

[Jaco-fiets]

a Low GI energy drink means nothing if your nutrition before ride was not low GI as well. The idea is to keep sugar levels constant with no insulin spikes. Having something with high GI before ride allready spikes your insulin levels. Now you consume a energy drink which has a slow release.

This is how i see the whole low GI approach thing.....

[Gravity Sux]

I have found when going hard for 5 or 6 hours, 32GI gets me about half way. During CPT last year I started with 32GI and switched to coke / water halfway (partly because I did not want to carry powder with me). Also ate banana / apple. This worked well for me and I have used this strategy since. 32GI is my first choice for training rides as it really does help with the excess kgs

[MDW]

davetapson, on 04 January 2012 - 08:00 , said:

Mid December I was probably as cycling fit as I've ever been. Family commitments, plus not being 100% well around then meant that my training stopped on the 15th.

So, on the 28th, feeling full of Christmas Pud etc, I figured "Well, I've had two weeks of solid taper, and a week of solid carbo loading - let's go and smash out a pb at Suikerbosrand..."

So...

I loaded up with low GI go-juice and headed out.

At Sedaven Dam I was about 10mins up on my normal time. Coming across the Western entrance road I was still about 10 mins up, but feeling not too full of energy. Coming over the ridges that lead down to the long stretch across the valley bottom before the big hill I was not coping so well. On the valley bottom I bonked so bad I nearly fell off my bike.

I dragged my sorry ass under a tree for half an hour or so to recover (as much as you can when you bonk) and then granny-geared to the bottom of the hill, walked up it (have NEVER walked on this hill) and shortcutted back down to the parking lot.

My suspicion is that low GI energy drinks cannot provide sufficient energy for long duration high intensity efforts.

Has anyone else found this?

(Yeah, yeah - I hear all the 'eat gels whadda whadda' but what I want to know is if other people find that low GI energy drinks are not sufficient to sustain long duration high intensity efforts on their own. Because 'old fashioned' high GI drinks can.)

PS: Note, I am a fan of the low GI idea, so not just trying to trash it for trashing sakes.

Hi Dave

Let me know what you ate the night before and morning before your ride, bonking is simply glycogen depletion, probably means you were over your threshold and not able to access your fat stores, in this case it would have been necessary to take in additional calories, drop me a mail I can analyse your nutrition and give you some advice. Most of my rides up to 70km I go on water and thats at a fairly high pace, its all about pre event nutrition and of course the level of your glycogen stores at the time you actually started riding, lots to say but need to head into a meeting :-) all the best m

[davetapson]

Hi MDW

This was a bit of a spur of the moment thing. Can't remember what I ate before going out, but it wouldn't have been much different from a normal day's eating. This could well have contributed to bonking. I did drink a serving of juice on the way out to SBR, which I was hoping would be enough to get me going, but it seems not.

I do my commuting (34km) on water, so I think that I should have some mobilisation of fat stores?

Regards
Dave

[Zac.A]

I do all my training on water with the occasional bar and races on water with gels and bars.

But in my opinion Cytomax is the way to go for a mix.

[MDW]

Zac.A, on 05 January 2012 - 01:04 , said:

I do all my training on water with the occasional bar and races on water with gels and bars.

But in my opinion Cytomax is the way to go for a mix.

Have you tried 32Gi Accelerate yet, would love to hear your feedback ;-)